Generations Leader Jetfire - Baltmatrix

[Pascal]

It wasn't a complaint, he just made the observation and said right away the toys were from 2 completely different lines anyway.

[imfallenangel]

Well I got mine last night.

First impression: cheap

The cheapest plastic I have ever seen for a transformers. I have dollar store knock-offs that have better plastic. No metal either.

It feels that if you do one thing wrong, you could and probably will end up with snapped parts.

Then, while it has some details in some ways, it lacks actual valid details. The hands do not move at all, the feet have no articulation.

Compared to the G1 (Macross) version, about the same size (I'll have to take it out and compare them next to each other), but the G1 is so very solid, built with metal parts, great plastic, the transformation doesn't have robots parts showing.

This one's only grace is the ratchet articulation for the hips/knees and shoulders/elbows. But again, due to the cheap plastic, I can see tic-tic-tic-SNAP happening easily.

The red chrome is a gimmick and doesn't really look that great.

The transformation is scary as there's not a step where you aren't going to fear that something will snap, and unless you only look at the robot or the top of plane mode, the undercarriage in plane mode is horrible.

I have both the G1 and the Voyager 2006 version and when the Voyager came out, the only thing I didn't like was the arms hanging on the side (plane mode undercarriage), but at least it does have a guardian/gerwalk mode.

The difference in quality between the three, is:

G1 was a solid toy. Strong thick plastic and metal. The accessories are a bit fragile and tricky at times but looks great. Once geared up, he looks a lot stronger, armored and extra weapons.

2006 Voyager is just as solid, a great update in just about every way except the undercarriage of the transformation of plane. The accessories are very solid, and extremely nice. He already looks very armored without the extra parts, with them he gives the impression of being unstoppable.

This one feels like a cheap model kit that's already put together.

The lack of "gadgets".. the non-retractable landing gear (wheels) in the back looks like sore thumbs sticking out, especially in robot mode (with wheels sticking on the side of the legs), somewhat concealed if you put on the leg cannons/armor. The front landing gear needs to be at an angle for the wheel to touch the ground, and looks like it could snap at any moment.

The articulations do work but are for the most part a very poor/cheap design. Every part of the arms and legs are empty, barely using a honeycomb approach.

The hands are not able to rotate, for a figure of this size is sad (the hands are part of the arm single piece. Sure, G1's hands didn't rotate, but the design of sliding inwards to hide them was the reason.

Even Voyager 2006's back boosters had the sliding pop-out cannons that are amazing.

Yes, in robot mode, as a display, he looks great (if you ignore all the emptiness of the parts and other faults), no denying that, and in plane, the top looks fine too. (but best to not even look at the undercarriage)

This version is just cheap, cheap plastic, cheap in design, cheap in details, etc.

My take is: this feels like it was designed to be a standard size figure (4-5 inch) and they decided to stretch it into a large size (and fells like they didn't want to use enough plastic/material to do it right).

Heck, I'd have to say that my G2 Cyberjet collection (that are barely 3-4 inch tall) are better designed (by a LOT).

I'm seriously debating about repacking him and getting my money back, which, after waiting so long for it, and my love for the jets/planes, means a lot and breaks my heart.

[jjwankenobi]

Oh Lord Primus, I pray to thee.

Give us G1 Skyfire combining the looks and size of Daca Toys' Kronos with build quality of this official release and thou shalt have my first born, no questions asked.

[Pascal]

Originally Posted by imfallenangel

Well I got mine last night.

First impression: cheap

The cheapest plastic I have ever seen for a transformers. I have dollar store knock-offs that have better plastic. No metal either.

It feels that if you do one thing wrong, you could and probably will end up with snapped parts.

Then, while it has some details in some ways, it lacks actual valid details. The hands do not move at all, the feet have no articulation.

Compared to the G1 (Macross) version, about the same size (I'll have to take it out and compare them next to each other), but the G1 is so very solid, built with metal parts, great plastic, the transformation doesn't have robots parts showing.

This one's only grace is the ratchet articulation for the hips/knees and shoulders/elbows. But again, due to the cheap plastic, I can see tic-tic-tic-SNAP happening easily.

The red chrome is a gimmick and doesn't really look that great.

The transformation is scary as there's not a step where you aren't going to fear that something will snap, and unless you only look at the robot or the top of plane mode, the undercarriage in plane mode is horrible.

I have both the G1 and the Voyager 2006 version and when the Voyager came out, the only thing I didn't like was the arms hanging on the side (plane mode undercarriage), but at least it does have a guardian/gerwalk mode.

The difference in quality between the three, is:

G1 was a solid toy. Strong thick plastic and metal. The accessories are a bit fragile and tricky at times but looks great. Once geared up, he looks a lot stronger, armored and extra weapons.

2006 Voyager is just as solid, a great update in just about every way except the undercarriage of the transformation of plane. The accessories are very solid, and extremely nice. He already looks very armored without the extra parts, with them he gives the impression of being unstoppable.

This one feels like a cheap model kit that's already put together.

The lack of "gadgets".. the non-retractable landing gear (wheels) in the back looks like sore thumbs sticking out, especially in robot mode (with wheels sticking on the side of the legs), somewhat concealed if you put on the leg cannons/armor. The front landing gear needs to be at an angle for the wheel to touch the ground, and looks like it could snap at any moment.

The articulations do work but are for the most part a very poor/cheap design. Every part of the arms and legs are empty, barely using a honeycomb approach.

The hands are not able to rotate, for a figure of this size is sad (the hands are part of the arm single piece. Sure, G1's hands didn't rotate, but the design of sliding inwards to hide them was the reason.

Even Voyager 2006's back boosters had the sliding pop-out cannons that are amazing.

Yes, in robot mode, as a display, he looks great (if you ignore all the emptiness of the parts and other faults), no denying that, and in plane, the top looks fine too. (but best to not even look at the undercarriage)

This version is just cheap, cheap plastic, cheap in design, cheap in details, etc.

My take is: this feels like it was designed to be a standard size figure (4-5 inch) and they decided to stretch it into a large size (and fells like they didn't want to use enough plastic/material to do it right).

Heck, I'd have to say that my G2 Cyberjet collection (that are barely 3-4 inch tall) are better designed (by a LOT).

I'm seriously debating about repacking him and getting my money back, which, after waiting so long for it, and my love for the jets/planes, means a lot and breaks my heart.

I got this toy too last night, and I absolutely disagree about the plastic quality or fear of breakage (unless you use a hammer to do so). You're confusing actual plastic quality with debatable construction techniques (like the hollowed out limbs). For sure it's no ROTF Prime in terms of complexity, but it does what it needs to do pretty well. Wrist or ankle articulation would have been nice, but it's far from being a standard on leader class toys, so I don't really mind.

[Buhawi]

^ I once took a knife to transform an FP stunticon. Had to cut off the excess plastic inside the arm preventing transformation. Kinda like how you have to shave Kronos' ankle swivels before transforming. I prefer the knife or sanding rather than using a hammer.

There's a part in jetfire where you have be careful handling. The main torso bit has two thinly placed areas. I wonder how you can reinforce it or if it's even possible.

The above is my only complaint. The gaudy beast wars chrome is the least of my worries since you can paint it easily.

I have to agree with you though. No shampoo bottle third party plastic here.

[DesertDog]

Those are some rose coloured glasses some guys are wearing. I also have G1 jetfire, and the voyager.

G1 JF has weak shoulder joints, I returned two that christmas, when the third one broke I gave up. Still have him, all yellow and brittle as fuck. The tail falls off too. Great looking figure though.

Voyager JF looks great in jet mode, but his proportions as a bot are just off. That battle helmet just doesn't look good, short arms, fat legs, no thanks. Looks like R2-D2's dad. Solid, but his transformation is not that complicated. Legs up, arms down, flip up the nose, fold down the tail. Wow, hard.

Leader JF looks almost as good as the G1, is far closer to Skyfire than the voyager, better proportioned, can stand upright, his weapons combine into different (shiny)configurations, and has a more convincing alt mode. He is in between the G1 and voyager for transformation complication IMHO. The only issues I have are the honeycomb arms, with no wrist swivels. I like the spartan look as well, but I'm sure Reprolabels will do something very cool for this figure.

[imfallenangel]

Originally Posted by Pascal

I got this toy too last night, and I absolutely disagree about the plastic quality or fear of breakage (unless you use a hammer to do so). You're confusing actual plastic quality with debatable construction techniques (like the hollowed out limbs). For sure it's no ROTF Prime in terms of complexity, but it does what it needs to do pretty well. Wrist or ankle articulation would have been nice, but it's far from being a standard on leader class toys, so I don't really mind.

You must have a different version than the one I got, 'cause the one I have is like similar to cheap model kit plastic. This one feels like it I was to apply any sort of pressure, it would snap.

Compared to the other 400 + transformers and other robot toys I have, this is not the same type of quality plastic. I can easily grab most of the planes I have by a wing and not worry that it'll snap off as it would have a bit of flexibility and a studier feel, this one, I wouldn't take the chance.

There's not a single other toy I have that I would do a finger flick on it that would resonate like this one does.

I'd say

Transformers Generations Armada Starscream would be the latest one I get that is a similar plastic, but it's still feels better than this.

[imfallenangel]

Originally Posted by DesertDog

G1 JF has weak shoulder joints, I returned two that christmas, when the third one broke I gave up. Still have him, all yellow and brittle as fuck. The tail falls off too. Great looking figure though.

I still have my G1 Jetfire in the box, but it's been taken out a lot, played with to death, and it had a broken wing (snapped in two) when I bought him (on liquidation, and the only one left).

I super-glued that wing and it's been fine ever since.

The worse is that the metal landing gear has "speckled" (not rust, but bumps in the metal due to oxidation), and very little yellowing that I've seen.

I think that I had to fix one of the ratchets, but considering the amount of play and age of the darn thing... it's held up great.

[Pascal]

Originally Posted by imfallenangel

You must have a different version than the one I got, 'cause the one I have is like similar to cheap model kit plastic. This one feels like it I was to apply any sort of pressure, it would snap.

Compared to the other 400 + transformers and other robot toys I have, this is not the same type of quality plastic. I can easily grab most of the planes I have by a wing and not worry that it'll snap off as it would have a bit of flexibility and a studier feel, this one, I wouldn't take the chance.

There's not a single other toy I have that I would do a finger flick on it that would resonate like this one does.

I'd say

Transformers Generations Armada Starscream would be the latest one I get that is a similar plastic, but it's still feels better than this.

No, I have the exact same version as you, I have more transforming toys than you (as if it mattered) that are not limited to just Transformers but several other lines of transforming robots, official or not, and I absolutely don't know what you're talking about. Was the honeycomb style a bad design call? More than likely. Does that make the plastic cheap? Certainly not. Use the same type of plastic on closed parts and you won't notice. Unless you're going to use brute force during transformation (I don't even see which steps would require that, the transformation is really straightforward), there's no way you're going to break that toy unless you do it on purpose.

[Ned1701]

Peaugh did his review back in early August https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lBbIix2sgY